Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea?

"Eeyore" <rabbitsfriendsandrelations.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4773CA68.FC771D04@hotmail.com...
>
>
> Richard wrote:
>
>> The Netherlands is one of the most densely "asphalted" countries on
>> earth. Also one of the most polluted by car traffic. Also one with
>> the
>> most traffic jams.
>
> I seriously doubt that.
>
> Try living in Soth East England. We can log-jam 12 lane motorways !
>
> Graham

LOL!
Cool! They should raise taxes....

Here the highway to Amsterdam is being widened, it will soon have 10
lanes.
If it helps to solve traffic jams, it will make more people decide
that its ok to take a job in Amsterdam centre and go there by... CAR

And cause traffic jams again?
The irony... I smile a lot .

Richard.
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

Richard wrote:
>
> "Edmund" <nomail DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:47738877$0$6466$bf4948fe@news.tele2.nl...
> > On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 05:25:29 +0000, Eeyore wrote:
> >
> >> Richard wrote:
> >>
> >>> For the record:
> >>> Road tax for 900 gasoline is 40 EURO per month,
> >>> road tax for 900 LPG is 95 EURO per month.
> >>
> >> Why more for LPG ? Do LPG cars damage the infrastructure more ? !
> >>
> >> Graham
> >
> > Its not "road tax" we don't have that.
> > ( they do not even use a fraction from all
> > those automotive tax billions for the roads )
> > It is possession tax if you have a car registered,
> > which is obligated, you have to pay this tax.
> > Because LPG is less expensive then petrol, our
> > government is taxing away the advantage from
> > people. In Netherland the government interested
> > in money only, nothing else matters.
> > Same is true for diesel cars.
> >
> > Edmund
>
> Edmund,
> Its not true that LPG is cheaper. Its just that it ....
> ... is less taxed!
> And for newer LPG cars (G3) the road-tax is about the same as for a
> gasoline car.
> But still... not many people switch to LPG. I dont know why. Because
> they dont like changes probably?

Initial investment. Scarcity of filling stations. A slight performance hit.
Higher engine temperatures. Reduction of boot space. Fear of gas leaks which
might lead poisoning or explosions.

However, you can get government grant (UK) for converting a new car.

> Diesel is still the most polluting car-fuel.

Agreed. The soot gets in everywhere.
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

johannes wrote:

> Richard wrote:
> > "Edmund" < wrote
> > > Eeyore wrote:
> > >> Richard wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> For the record:
> > >>> Road tax for 900 gasoline is 40 EURO per month,
> > >>> road tax for 900 LPG is 95 EURO per month.
> > >>
> > >> Why more for LPG ? Do LPG cars damage the infrastructure more ? !
> > >>
> > >> Graham
> > >
> > > Its not "road tax" we don't have that.
> > > ( they do not even use a fraction from all
> > > those automotive tax billions for the roads )
> > > It is possession tax if you have a car registered,
> > > which is obligated, you have to pay this tax.
> > > Because LPG is less expensive then petrol, our
> > > government is taxing away the advantage from
> > > people. In Netherland the government interested
> > > in money only, nothing else matters.
> > > Same is true for diesel cars.
> > >
> > > Edmund
> >
> > Edmund,
> > Its not true that LPG is cheaper. Its just that it ....
> > ... is less taxed!
> > And for newer LPG cars (G3) the road-tax is about the same as for a
> > gasoline car.
> > But still... not many people switch to LPG. I dont know why. Because
> > they dont like changes probably?
>
> Initial investment. Scarcity of filling stations. A slight performance hit.
> Higher engine temperatures. Reduction of boot space. Fear of gas leaks which
> might lead poisoning or explosions.
>
> However, you can get government grant (UK) for converting a new car.

Begs the question WHY !


> > Diesel is still the most polluting car-fuel.
>
> Agreed. The soot gets in everywhere.

I thought the latest EU diesel legislation fixed that ? Soot results from
over-fuelling only AIUI and that's associated with primitive mechanical fuel
injection systems. Electronic injection as per gasoline vehicles should
eliminate that.

WHY it took so long to get electronic fuel control into diesels is a question
you might well ask.

Graham
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 11:19:54 +0000, Eeyore wrote:

> Edmund wrote:
>
>> still just me wrote:
>> > Edmund <nomail RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >>Eeyore wrote:
>> >

>>
>> Besides that we have a zillion different taxes and sneaky
>> local taxes that are called different.
>
Just curious. The very high tax burden in continental Europe is widely
> attributed to the cost of providing fairly generous 'social provision' like
> state pensions, health service and unemployment and illness benefits.
>
> In view of those high taxes are people generally (in your opinion) still
> willing to pay this much for those services ?

Hard to tell, I really do not want to go into detail
with all this, but a lot of people realize it is getting
worse and worse.
I heard there never where more people leaving the
country then at this time, in my personal surroundings
several have emigrated to spain.
Most people here don't have a clue from what is happening
and the Dutch only complain but never take any action and
never protest to anything. I that way you can say they are
"willing" to pay for it.

> Graham

Edmund
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 16:41:21 +0100, Richard wrote:

> "Edmund" <nomail.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:47737a54$0$4628$bf4948fe@news.tele2.nl...
>> On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:28:54 +0000, still just me wrote:
>>
>>> On 26 Dec 2007 17:45:42 GMT, Edmund <nomail.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:52:42 +0000, Eeyore wrote:
>>>

>>
>> We don't have road tax anymore, we used to call
>> it road tax but since our government did use this
>> "road tax" for all but the roads it was called an illegal
>> tax and now it is named it different.
>
> ... and still the money is spent on car-related issues.
>

No it is not!
>
>> For a 1200 kg car on petrol we pay 432 Euro/year tax
>> 880 euro/year on diesel
>> 932 euro/year on LPG
>
> ONLY for cars that have the old LPG system, the newer cars (1996 -> )
> have G3, and then the tax is around 500 EURO...

Around 500? it is 600 and rising, on top of that one need a very
expensive G3 installation.
>
>> Our gas prizes are most tax too one litre petrol costs 1.48 euro!, not
>> a gallon, a litre.
>
> Yes, and LPG is 0,60 per liter.
>
>> For a new car we pay an additional 4 % import tax then about 23 %
>> illegal tax which we call BPM and over the new sum we pay 19 % BTW,
>> next year that will be 20 %.
>
> Some say it is illegal, but every country in Europe can decide on their
> own tax system.
> No, BTW will remain 19% in 2008.

I corrected that it will be 20% a year later.
>
>> I heard only Denmark is more expansive but they urn about twice as much
>> as we do in Netherland.
>
> Not true. The average income in DK is only a bit higher than in NL.
That is not what I heard from people I met during the holidays.
Besides that it is impossible to compare with all the sneaky
hidden taxes and costs we have here.

>
>> Parking a car is next to impossible and cost up to 4.75 euro/hour.
>
> What are you doing with a car in an old city center never designed for
> cars?

Driving to my work.
> If you live in a city centre you get / buy a parking licence.
That is so cheap right? NOT.

If you go
> to a city centre you park outside the center for cheap and get a free
> bus ticket.

Parking in alkmaar isn't cheap, parking in Amsterdam is impossible
and expensive and your car is robbed when you come back.
Nowhere you get a free bus ticket either.
>
>> Our smart government invented a new way to squeeze even more money out
>> of us, in a few years time we have pay for each km we actually drive in
>> our car in addition to all this.
>
> Not true.
> If you drive less than average you pay less.

Wanne make a bet on it?
>
>> We have to buy a GPS device which records every inch that our cars
>> moves and we have to pay for that too.
>
> Not true.
> There has been discussion about such a system, but it has been postponed
> until it is technically feasable... and acceptable in terms of privacy.
> It doesnt look like it is going to happen.

There is no such thing as privacy in Netherland, and the government
is not telling anything yet ( ministry of information ) but they
are already taking "irreversible steps", these are there exact words!

>
>> Besides that we have a zillion different taxes and sneaky local taxes
>> that are called different.
>
> ... to pay for all the problems car-owners and drivers are causing!

No they don't, they spent only a fraction of it on
roads and stuff. But they give themself a 30 % raise in pay.

Edmund
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

Eeyore wrote:
>
> johannes wrote:
>
> > Richard wrote:
> > > "Edmund" < wrote
> > > > Eeyore wrote:
> > > >> Richard wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> For the record:
> > > >>> Road tax for 900 gasoline is 40 EURO per month,
> > > >>> road tax for 900 LPG is 95 EURO per month.
> > > >>
> > > >> Why more for LPG ? Do LPG cars damage the infrastructure more ? !
> > > >>
> > > >> Graham
> > > >
> > > > Its not "road tax" we don't have that.
> > > > ( they do not even use a fraction from all
> > > > those automotive tax billions for the roads )
> > > > It is possession tax if you have a car registered,
> > > > which is obligated, you have to pay this tax.
> > > > Because LPG is less expensive then petrol, our
> > > > government is taxing away the advantage from
> > > > people. In Netherland the government interested
> > > > in money only, nothing else matters.
> > > > Same is true for diesel cars.
> > > >
> > > > Edmund
> > >
> > > Edmund,
> > > Its not true that LPG is cheaper. Its just that it ....
> > > ... is less taxed!
> > > And for newer LPG cars (G3) the road-tax is about the same as for a
> > > gasoline car.
> > > But still... not many people switch to LPG. I dont know why. Because
> > > they dont like changes probably?
> >
> > Initial investment. Scarcity of filling stations. A slight performance hit.
> > Higher engine temperatures. Reduction of boot space. Fear of gas leaks which
> > might lead poisoning or explosions.
> >
> > However, you can get government grant (UK) for converting a new car.
>
> Begs the question WHY !
>
> > > Diesel is still the most polluting car-fuel.
> >
> > Agreed. The soot gets in everywhere.
>
> I thought the latest EU diesel legislation fixed that ? Soot results from
> over-fuelling only AIUI and that's associated with primitive mechanical fuel
> injection systems. Electronic injection as per gasoline vehicles should
> eliminate that.

Probably most of it comes from lorries and busses.. I live not far from a
motorway. The soot spreads out by stealth; you don't really notice it until
you wipe the walls by a damp cloth.


> WHY it took so long to get electronic fuel control into diesels is a question
> you might well ask.

Maybe because one of the original attractions of the diesel engine was that
it didn't need an electric system to run. The old distributor was always a
weak point in petrol engines.
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

On Dec 27, 7:37 pm, Edmund <nom... RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 10:35:39 -0800, PJGH wrote:
> > On Dec 26, 11:31 am, Edmund <nom... RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hi Edmund - Good choice with a SAAB.
>
> > For the period you are looking at, there were three SAAB mdoels
> > available on the market: the 96, the 99 and the 900.
> > Of those models, the 99 and 900 are more popular, but there is nothing
> > wrong with the 96 of the day.
> > Of the 99 and 900, there were carburetted and turbo-charged variants
> > for the 99 and the 900 and a fuel-injected model for the 900.
>
> > It comes down to personal choice over the model and the engine, but
> > the turbo cars were pretty awesome, even then - the 99 was the turbo-
> > classic of the day. Black, two door. Lovely.
> > That said, the 900 is more plentiful for parts (although that might
> > depend on where you live), but both the 99 and 900 shared the Bosch
> > CIS/K-Jet system (on the FI & turbo cars) that was used on VW & Audi
> > back then; a lot of parts are still available new from Bosch.
>
> > Why specifically 1980-1983?
>
> 25 years old mean I don't have to pay tax for owning
> the car, at least for a few years to come.
> A car like this on LPG means saving about 950 euro's a year.

Ah ... okay, I understand that. I wondered whether 1980-1983 was
chosen for a specific model.

> > Pre-APC? 1983 was the year SAAB launced APC for the turbo cars and that
> > engine configuration was a stunner.
>
> Sorry what is APC?

I will refer you to Wikipedia, if I may?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_Performance_Control

... essentially an early "boost controller" to allow the turbo car to
run reliably on all grades of fuel.
I do not know how adaptive it is for running LPG. Does anyone else
know, for certain?

> > One year I would steer clear of is 1980 - there was a steel strike in
> > Sweden that year and cheaper imported steel was used, but was not as
> > well treated. Cars from that year seem more prone to rust, if they are
> > still around. 1979 was the launch year of the 900, 1980, the final
> > year for the 96 and 1984 the final year for the 99. By 1982, SAAB had
> > got over the complicated GL, GLS, GLi, GLSi and EMS models (in most
> > markets) and fuel injection was very much commonplace.
>
> > Me? I'd go for either a fuel-injected or turbo-charged 900. Both are
> > very good cars, but the turbo was quite a stunner.
> > Fuel mileage? 10 Km/L shouldn't be a problem, but I just ran 25 MPG
> > through google conversion, so I don't know it that is proper gallons
> > or those little US gallons
>
> Where ( which country ) do you live?
> Why all these people say I shouldn't buy such an
> old Saab? I think these Saabs looks nice and solid, but
> reading these replies .........
> I also heard the turbo's are not the most reliable and
> it might not be best suited for converting to LPG.

I am in the UK. I have run "Classic" 900s as my daily car for about
seven years now and so does my wife.

The turbo car is as reliable as the fuel injected car, in fact, it is
the best of the model line-up for that period. Pre-APC turbo cars (the
ones before 1983) must run on high octane petrol and do not run as
high boost (so, less power) as the cars with the APC system. You might
(just) find a car fitted with APC that was over 25 years old.
However ...

Since LPG seems to be the fuel system you require, do consider the
normal fuel injected car. In this period (for the 8V 900), the fuel
system simply squirted fuel in all the time (hence, CIS - continuous
injection). I don't pretend to know much about LPG, but if all you
need to do is drill the intake runners and fit new injectors, set up
the timing to go bang at the right time, then the SAAB 900 8V engine
is about as simple as it gets. I know of many successful LPG
installations in Volvos and VWs from the early part of the 1980s and
their engines were very similar to SAAB's.

I do not know how a turbo car would cope with LPG. Can someone else
enlighten us here?

> Thanks for your info

My pleasure
Do check out the forums at http://www.saabforum.nl and find ask about
how people have installed LPG into their old SAABs. It is not very
popular in the UK, but I know it is more popular in Europe.
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 10:35:39 -0800, PJGH wrote:

> On Dec 26, 11:31 am, Edmund <nom....TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
> Hi Edmund - Good choice with a SAAB.
>
> For the period you are looking at, there were three SAAB mdoels
> available on the market: the 96, the 99 and the 900.
> Of those models, the 99 and 900 are more popular, but there is nothing
> wrong with the 96 of the day.
> Of the 99 and 900, there were carburetted and turbo-charged variants
> for the 99 and the 900 and a fuel-injected model for the 900.
>
> It comes down to personal choice over the model and the engine, but
> the turbo cars were pretty awesome, even then - the 99 was the turbo-
> classic of the day. Black, two door. Lovely.
> That said, the 900 is more plentiful for parts (although that might
> depend on where you live), but both the 99 and 900 shared the Bosch
> CIS/K-Jet system (on the FI & turbo cars) that was used on VW & Audi
> back then; a lot of parts are still available new from Bosch.
>
> Why specifically 1980-1983?

25 years old mean I don't have to pay tax for owning
the car, at least for a few years to come.
A car like this on LPG means saving about 950 euro's a year.
>
> Pre-APC? 1983 was the year SAAB launced APC for the turbo cars and that
> engine configuration was a stunner.

Sorry what is APC?

> One year I would steer clear of is 1980 - there was a steel strike in
> Sweden that year and cheaper imported steel was used, but was not as
> well treated. Cars from that year seem more prone to rust, if they are
> still around. 1979 was the launch year of the 900, 1980, the final
> year for the 96 and 1984 the final year for the 99. By 1982, SAAB had
> got over the complicated GL, GLS, GLi, GLSi and EMS models (in most
> markets) and fuel injection was very much commonplace.
>
> Me? I'd go for either a fuel-injected or turbo-charged 900. Both are
> very good cars, but the turbo was quite a stunner.
> Fuel mileage? 10 Km/L shouldn't be a problem, but I just ran 25 MPG
> through google conversion, so I don't know it that is proper gallons
> or those little US gallons

Where ( which country ) do you live?
Why all these people say I shouldn't buy such an
old Saab? I think these Saabs looks nice and solid, but
reading these replies .........
I also heard the turbo's are not the most reliable and
it might not be best suited for converting to LPG.

Thanks for your info

Edmund
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

"Edmund" <nomail.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4773ed5f$0$2840$bf4948fe@news.tele2.nl...
> On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 16:41:21 +0100, Richard wrote:
>
>> "Edmund" <nomail.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:47737a54$0$4628$bf4948fe@news.tele2.nl...
>>> On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:28:54 +0000, still just me wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 26 Dec 2007 17:45:42 GMT, Edmund <nomail.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:52:42 +0000, Eeyore wrote:
>>>>
>
>>>
>>> We don't have road tax anymore, we used to call
>>> it road tax but since our government did use this
>>> "road tax" for all but the roads it was called an illegal
>>> tax and now it is named it different.
>>
>> ... and still the money is spent on car-related issues.
>>
>
> No it is not!
>>
>>> For a 1200 kg car on petrol we pay 432 Euro/year tax
>>> 880 euro/year on diesel
>>> 932 euro/year on LPG
>>
>> ONLY for cars that have the old LPG system, the newer cars
>> (1996 -> )
>> have G3, and then the tax is around 500 EURO...
>
> Around 500? it is 600 and rising, on top of that one need a very
> expensive G3 installation.
>>
>>> Our gas prizes are most tax too one litre petrol costs 1.48 euro!,
>>> not
>>> a gallon, a litre.
>>
>> Yes, and LPG is 0,60 per liter.
>>
>>> For a new car we pay an additional 4 % import tax then about 23 %
>>> illegal tax which we call BPM and over the new sum we pay 19 %
>>> BTW,
>>> next year that will be 20 %.
>>
>> Some say it is illegal, but every country in Europe can decide on
>> their
>> own tax system.
>> No, BTW will remain 19% in 2008.
>
> I corrected that it will be 20% a year later.
>>
>>> I heard only Denmark is more expansive but they urn about twice as
>>> much
>>> as we do in Netherland.
>>
>> Not true. The average income in DK is only a bit higher than in NL.
> That is not what I heard from people I met during the holidays.
> Besides that it is impossible to compare with all the sneaky
> hidden taxes and costs we have here.
>
>>
>>> Parking a car is next to impossible and cost up to 4.75 euro/hour.
>>
>> What are you doing with a car in an old city center never designed
>> for
>> cars?
>
> Driving to my work.
>> If you live in a city centre you get / buy a parking licence.
> That is so cheap right? NOT.
>
> If you go
>> to a city centre you park outside the center for cheap and get a
>> free
>> bus ticket.
>
> Parking in alkmaar isn't cheap, parking in Amsterdam is impossible
> and expensive and your car is robbed when you come back.
> Nowhere you get a free bus ticket either.
>>
>>> Our smart government invented a new way to squeeze even more money
>>> out
>>> of us, in a few years time we have pay for each km we actually
>>> drive in
>>> our car in addition to all this.
>>
>> Not true.
>> If you drive less than average you pay less.
>
> Wanne make a bet on it?
>>
>>> We have to buy a GPS device which records every inch that our cars
>>> moves and we have to pay for that too.
>>
>> Not true.
>> There has been discussion about such a system, but it has been
>> postponed
>> until it is technically feasable... and acceptable in terms of
>> privacy.
>> It doesnt look like it is going to happen.
>
> There is no such thing as privacy in Netherland, and the government
> is not telling anything yet ( ministry of information ) but they
> are already taking "irreversible steps", these are there exact
> words!
>
>>
>>> Besides that we have a zillion different taxes and sneaky local
>>> taxes
>>> that are called different.
>>
>> ... to pay for all the problems car-owners and drivers are causing!
>>
>
> No they don't, they spent only a fraction of it on
> roads and stuff. But they give themself a 30 % raise in pay.
>
> Edmund

Dear Edmund,
I think you are just wining. I am sorry. Here are the numbers.


Spending of government departments in 2006:
Total expenses related to cars and transport:
6 290 + 7 073 = 13 363 million + 6 458 ? = 19 821 million

http://statline.cbs.nl/StatWeb/Table.asp?STB=G1&LA=nl&DM=SLNL&PA=60050...=a&D2=a(l-4)-l&HDR=T&LYR=G2:4

Total tax income from cars and trucks:
2 143 + 513 + 3 452 + 94 + 3 982 + 2 836 +4 545 = 17 565 million.


http://statline.cbs.nl/StatWeb/Table.asp?STB=T&LA=nl&DM=SLNL&PA=70122n...D1=a&D2(l-5)-l&HDR=G1

It depends on what you add and what not. You can also add some of the
health related costs... but I didnt.
I think income and expenses are close.


Average car in NL is 1135 kg (2004), tax is 500 Euro for LPG G3.
http://www.cbs.nl/nl-NL/menu/themas/verkeer-vervoer/publicaties/artike.../archie

and

http://www.belastingdienst.nl/reken/motorrijtuigenbelasting/


Average income in NL and DK is comparable, even a percent or so higher
in NL, but taxes are higher:
GDP NL: 132.6
GDP DK: 126.0

http://epp.eurostat.cec.eu.int/portal/page?_pageid=1996,39140985&_dad=...tal&_sc


and:
http://www.cbs.nl/nl-NL/menu/themas/dossiers/eu/cijfers/default.htm

http://epp.eurostat.cec.eu.int/portal/page?_pageid=1996,39140985&_dad=...tal&_sc


The tax per km has been postponed until AFTER the next elections. We
all know what will happen then, because nobody wants to pay more for
their cars.
The system will only be applied to trucks.
I want to take up that bet, yes.

There is no "ministry of information" in NL. What do you mean?
The system to track you is based on RFID chips technology, that has
nothing to do with GPS.

"They" ? Are you getting paranoid?

The only people I know that moved abroad were the people that had so
much money that they didnt have to care about social security, and
tried to move the money to another country where they pay less tax, or
no taxes at all.
Most of them went to Belgium or Luxemburg, less than 150 km away, and
drove to Holland a few times per week.
Oh drove? By car? Really? Yes, really...

Why you want to go to Amsterdam centre by CAR from Alkmaar is totally
beyond me.
But you will have a reason to complain... I agree. I bet you even
have to drive in rush hour?

No more responses from me, I am totally put off by your compaining.
Sorry.

Richard.
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

On Dec 28, 10:03 am, Edmund <nom....TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I think I will take a look at such a Saab 900 8V.
> Does that stands for 8 valve or something else.
> Are all the engines the same in a Saab 900 8V
> if not what is the best durable engine?

8V = Eight Valve, yes.

The 8V engine is known as the B201. The car engine code will start
with B201 on the ownership documents.

There were two variants of this engine, B & H.

The B engine (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saab_B_engine) was
derived from Triumph. This was fitted to the 99 model and the early
900 model (up to about 1981).
The H engine (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saab_H_engine) is a
further development and considered to be the better of the two. The so-
called H engine was available as both an 8V and 16V, as 2.0L, 2.1L and
2.3L in various models up to very recently). For your interest (up to
about 1983), there were only 8V engines in the 900. The better one for
your needs is the B201 H engine. You will be able to spot this,
because it was a silver cam cover (see:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1b/SaabHengine.j...300px-S),
whereas the older B engines had a black cam cover (see:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8f/1974-SAAB99LE...gine.jp).
If it says 16V on the cam cover (like:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/1993_Saab_900...onverti),
it is a newer engine.

The normally aspirated fuel injection engine is the most simple. If
you want to squirt the fuel into the intake snorkel then go ahead. I
have seen installations where the intake runners (after the throttle)
were drilled, tapped and had injectors inserted. This is a much better
proposition for if you decided upon a turbocharged model. You can see
the long intake runners in some of the pictures on Wiki. Although a B
engine this picture (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/
thumb/8/8f/1974-SAAB99LE-engine.jpg/350px-1974-SAAB99LE-engine.jpg)
shows the long intake runners and the fuel injectors bored into the
head. For LPG installations (and just extra fuelling for people
running very high boost), I have seen the intake runners drilled about
2 inches back from where the normal petrol injectors are.

Is the 900 becoming a viable car for your needs?
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 15:42:46 -0800, PJGH wrote:

> On Dec 27, 7:37 pm, Edmund <nom....RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 10:35:39 -0800, PJGH wrote:
>> > On Dec 26, 11:31 am, Edmund <nom....RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>

>
> Ah ... okay, I understand that. I wondered whether 1980-1983 was
> chosen for a specific model.
>
>> > Pre-APC? 1983 was the year SAAB launced APC for the turbo cars and that
>> > engine configuration was a stunner.
>>
>> Sorry what is APC?
>
> I will refer you to Wikipedia, if I may?
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_Performance_Control
>
> ... essentially an early "boost controller" to allow the turbo car to
> run reliably on all grades of fuel.
> I do not know how adaptive it is for running LPG. Does anyone else
> know, for certain?

OK I do understand that and I do know a little about engines
and fuel in general. In principe LPG should do just fine in
a turbo engine because of the high octane number of LPG.
However with the "old" LPG system where the gas in sucked in
via the air intake.........might not be a good idea since the
explosive mixture is then going through the turbo.

>
> Since LPG seems to be the fuel system you require, do consider the
> normal fuel injected car. In this period (for the 8V 900), the fuel
> system simply squirted fuel in all the time (hence, CIS - continuous
> injection). I don't pretend to know much about LPG, but if all you
> need to do is drill the intake runners and fit new injectors, set up
> the timing to go bang at the right time, then the SAAB 900 8V engine
> is about as simple as it gets. I know of many successful LPG
> installations in Volvos and VWs from the early part of the 1980s and
> their engines were very similar to SAAB's.

I think I will take a look at such a Saab 900 8V.
Does that stands for 8 valve or something else.
Are all the engines the same in a Saab 900 8V
if not what is the best durable engine?

Edmund
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

"Edmund" <nomail DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4774c9df$0$30338$bf4948fe@news.tele2.nl...
> On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 15:42:46 -0800, PJGH wrote:
>
>> On Dec 27, 7:37 pm, Edmund <nom... DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 10:35:39 -0800, PJGH wrote:
>>> > On Dec 26, 11:31 am, Edmund <nom... DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>
>>
>> Ah ... okay, I understand that. I wondered whether 1980-1983 was
>> chosen for a specific model.
>>
>>> > Pre-APC? 1983 was the year SAAB launced APC for the turbo cars
>>> > and that
>>> > engine configuration was a stunner.
>>>
>>> Sorry what is APC?
>>
>> I will refer you to Wikipedia, if I may?
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_Performance_Control
>>
>> ... essentially an early "boost controller" to allow the turbo car
>> to
>> run reliably on all grades of fuel.
>> I do not know how adaptive it is for running LPG. Does anyone else
>> know, for certain?
>
> OK I do understand that and I do know a little about engines
> and fuel in general. In principe LPG should do just fine in
> a turbo engine because of the high octane number of LPG.
> However with the "old" LPG system where the gas in sucked in
> via the air intake.........might not be a good idea since the
> explosive mixture is then going through the turbo.
>
>>
>> Since LPG seems to be the fuel system you require, do consider the
>> normal fuel injected car. In this period (for the 8V 900), the fuel
>> system simply squirted fuel in all the time (hence, CIS -
>> continuous
>> injection). I don't pretend to know much about LPG, but if all you
>> need to do is drill the intake runners and fit new injectors, set
>> up
>> the timing to go bang at the right time, then the SAAB 900 8V
>> engine
>> is about as simple as it gets. I know of many successful LPG
>> installations in Volvos and VWs from the early part of the 1980s
>> and
>> their engines were very similar to SAAB's.
>
> I think I will take a look at such a Saab 900 8V.
> Does that stands for 8 valve or something else.
> Are all the engines the same in a Saab 900 8V
> if not what is the best durable engine?
>
> Edmund

Please stop trolling now, ok?

Richard.
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea? 

On Jan 2, 8:51 pm, Edmund <nom....DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 28 Dec 2007 05:50:36 -0800, PJGH wrote:
> > On Dec 28, 10:03 am, Edmund <nom....DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Is the 900 becoming a viable car for your needs?
>
> The 900 looks nice to me if I can find one.
> On internet I see more 99 models and I don't even
> know the difference with the 900 models but I do like
> the solid impression the Saabs are given me.
> Still a little worried about the engines. But if it
> sounds and runs good I might buy one.
> Thanks a lot for all your information.

For the period you are looking at (1979-1983), they will all be eight
valve engines.
Look at the back of the car - GL, GLE, GLS and EMS will all be
carburetted. If it says "turbo" it is ... if there is a turbo under
the bonnet (look next to the battery), it's a turbo.
If it says 900i on the back, it's a normally aspirated car (no turbo)
- I think that's the one you want.

Do be aware that SAAB engines of this period will be dramatically
improved with new spark plugs, leads, cap and rotor arm, perhaps a
coil (all cheap enough) and replacing the rubber vacuum hose with
silicon (again very cheap).
Once replaced, set the timing and the mixture and you're done - happy
motoring.
 >> Stay informed about: Buying an old (1980-1983) Saab good idea?