The All-New 2006 3 Series

 > Hello there, have you been to BMW's website? I saw their new 3-series today
 > and I was relieved to see that it doesn't look as bad as the 5-series.

It's sad that this is actually praise for a new model. Shows how bad
things have become. I agree with you by the way, not at all nuts about
the new style dashboard and interior layouts though.

I'm sure it's a very well ingineered car, the new 3.0 six should be a
real screamer

--
Who needs a life when you've got Unix?
Email: john DeleteThis @unixnerd.demon.co.uk, John G.Burns B.Eng, Bonny Scotland
Web : <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk" target="_blank">http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk</a> - The Ultimate BMW Homepage!
Need Sun or HP Unix kit? <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/unix.html" target="_blank">http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/unix.html</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

Going through the pictures at the web site...

Don't care for the slope of the nose/hood.

Rear looks OK (nut no better than that).

Hate the slash on the side of the car. The huge bumper cover/rear
quarter seam behind the rear wheel is...huge and breaks up the flow as
your eye passes over it.

Interior looks bland. Picture it without the steering wheel and it is
frighteningly bland.

From the top left view they give it looks squat and fat. I think the
E46 looks better than the G35, but the E90 puts them at parity, at best.
A definite step backwards (and I don't mean to earlier generation 3-Series).

Watch the video and you see how the front and rear just don't go
together. The front is very "new look" the rear is very "traditional".
The front looks like a Mitsubishi was the inspiration. Not the best
inspiration.

I am very wary of the active steering.

The new BMW 3 liter six with 255 hp will likely be incrementally better
than the M54 six, which is not a bad thing to say since that engine is
just excellent. However, Infiniti is at 298 hp in the G35 - that's
closer to M3 power than the new BMW six is to G35 power. Not good.

I think they've lost their way. The car will sell OK because there
really is very little small sedan RWD competition and because it still
is a BMW and some people will buy nothing else.

- GRL

Cutiebunny wrote:
 > Hello there, have you been to BMW's website? I saw their new 3-series today
 > and I was relieved to see that it doesn't look as bad as the 5-series.
 > Overall it looks fine, although I still prefer the hood on the current
 > 3-series, in which the kidney grills are built into the hood. The new
 > 3-series hood is separated from the kidney grills, just like the new
 > 5-series. The new 3 supposedly has a better performance but I hope it is
 > also as reliable.
 >
 > What do you all think of the new 3-series?
 >
 >
 > Cutiebunny.
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

in article cYcBd.1427$qQ5.583@fe03.lga, GRL at GLitwinski RemoveThis @chartermi.net
wrote on 12/31/04 7:54 AM:

 > The new BMW 3 liter six with 255 hp will likely be incrementally better
 > than the M54 six, which is not a bad thing to say since that engine is
 > just excellent. However, Infiniti is at 298 hp in the G35 - that's
 > closer to M3 power than the new BMW six is to G35 power. Not good.



Horsepower is one thing, performance is something else. The existing G35
coupe at 280HP is no quicker than your ZHP at 235. Infiniti's HP numbers
don't seem to translate very well into performance differences. E.g.,the
sedan at 260 vs the coupe at 280 have nearly identical acceleration. And the
fact that BMW promises both improved fuel economy and more power with less
weight, tells me that this is a real advancement in engine design, not just
another tweak of valves, cams, and exhaust as in the Nissan. Certainly those
tweaks can increase power, but probably at the cost of fuel economy and
vibration. That V6 is already pushing the limits on these fronts. It will
be interesting to see how much the numbers on the 2005 G35 6mt improve over
the 04. I've ruled out ever owning the G35 because I just don't think the
engine comes even close to the BMW in refinement. There's something just not
that appealing about having basically the same engine as the Nissan Quest
minivan down the block.

 > I think they've lost their way. The car will sell OK because there
 > really is very little small sedan RWD competition and because it still
 > is a BMW and some people will buy nothing else.

Why not wait till you see it in person and give it a test drive. You might
be pleasantly surprised.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

In home market Germany in some months outsold by C-Class, always trounced by
VW Golf/Bora.

I doubt people base their decision on where the drive wheels are.

DAS
--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---

"GRL" <GLitwinski.RemoveThis@chartermi.net> wrote in message
news:cYcBd.1427$qQ5.583@fe03.lga...
 > Going through the pictures at the web site...
 >
 > Don't care for the slope of the nose/hood.
 >
 > Rear looks OK (nut no better than that).
 >
 > Hate the slash on the side of the car. The huge bumper cover/rear quarter
 > seam behind the rear wheel is...huge and breaks up the flow as your eye
 > passes over it.
 >
 > Interior looks bland. Picture it without the steering wheel and it is
 > frighteningly bland.
 >
 > From the top left view they give it looks squat and fat. I think the E46
 > looks better than the G35, but the E90 puts them at parity, at best. A
 > definite step backwards (and I don't mean to earlier generation 3-Series).
 >
 > Watch the video and you see how the front and rear just don't go together.
 > The front is very "new look" the rear is very "traditional". The front
 > looks like a Mitsubishi was the inspiration. Not the best inspiration.
 >
 > I am very wary of the active steering.
 >
 > The new BMW 3 liter six with 255 hp will likely be incrementally better
 > than the M54 six, which is not a bad thing to say since that engine is
 > just excellent. However, Infiniti is at 298 hp in the G35 - that's closer
 > to M3 power than the new BMW six is to G35 power. Not good.
 >
 > I think they've lost their way. The car will sell OK because there really
 > is very little small sedan RWD competition and because it still is a BMW
 > and some people will buy nothing else.
 >
 > - GRL
 >
 > Cutiebunny wrote:
  >> Hello there, have you been to BMW's website? I saw their new 3-series
  >> today and I was relieved to see that it doesn't look as bad as the
  >> 5-series. Overall it looks fine, although I still prefer the hood on the
  >> current 3-series, in which the kidney grills are built into the hood.
  >> The new 3-series hood is separated from the kidney grills, just like the
  >> new 5-series. The new 3 supposedly has a better performance but I hope it
  >> is also as reliable.
  >>
  >> What do you all think of the new 3-series?
  >>
  >>
  >> Cutiebunny.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

As to the last point, true enough in terms of driving, but I was referring
to esthetics. Might drive great. That will have no effect on the styling,
though.

You should not be so hard on the Nissan V6. It is, by any standard, an
excellent engine. When I drove the 260 hp version this summer in a G35, I
felt it was as good as the M54 six. The car book guys love it. I could not
care less that it is found in loads of Nissans. Far as I'm concerned, that
just subsidizes the development cost of an excellent engine that might not
exist otherwise in G35's. An excellent engine is an excellent engine.
Period. People bitch and moan about the OHV V6's that GM still manufactures.
But the GM V6 makes more power and gives better mileage than competitors in
line fours. I say that makes the GM V6 a superior engine, even if it dates
back decades.

The G35 has been a bit slower than the E46 equivalents. But I suspect that
has something to do with the G35 being a bigger (heavier) car. Big adds
comfort, but it subtracts performance.

- GRL
"John Stone" <jmsent2.DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:BDFABF8E.15BA6%jmsent2@comcast.net...
 > in article cYcBd.1427$qQ5.583@fe03.lga, GRL at GLitwinski.DeleteThis@chartermi.net
 > wrote on 12/31/04 7:54 AM:
 >
  > > The new BMW 3 liter six with 255 hp will likely be incrementally better
  > > than the M54 six, which is not a bad thing to say since that engine is
  > > just excellent. However, Infiniti is at 298 hp in the G35 - that's
  > > closer to M3 power than the new BMW six is to G35 power. Not good.
 >
 >
 >
 > Horsepower is one thing, performance is something else. The existing G35
 > coupe at 280HP is no quicker than your ZHP at 235. Infiniti's HP numbers
 > don't seem to translate very well into performance differences. E.g.,the
 > sedan at 260 vs the coupe at 280 have nearly identical acceleration. And
the
 > fact that BMW promises both improved fuel economy and more power with less
 > weight, tells me that this is a real advancement in engine design, not
just
 > another tweak of valves, cams, and exhaust as in the Nissan. Certainly
those
 > tweaks can increase power, but probably at the cost of fuel economy and
 > vibration. That V6 is already pushing the limits on these fronts. It will
 > be interesting to see how much the numbers on the 2005 G35 6mt improve
over
 > the 04. I've ruled out ever owning the G35 because I just don't think the
 > engine comes even close to the BMW in refinement. There's something just
not
 > that appealing about having basically the same engine as the Nissan Quest
 > minivan down the block.
 >
  > > I think they've lost their way. The car will sell OK because there
  > > really is very little small sedan RWD competition and because it still
  > > is a BMW and some people will buy nothing else.
 >
 > Why not wait till you see it in person and give it a test drive. You might
 > be pleasantly surprised.
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

Isn't the Golf a lot cheaper? Also smaller? RWD matters a lot to people who
enjoy great handling. Less so to people who are after interior room, bang
for the Euro, and better traction on snow.


- GRL
"Dori A Schmetterling" <ng DeleteThis @nospam.co.uk> wrote in message
news:41d5659e$0$16589$cc9e4d1f@news-text.dial.pipex.com...
 > In home market Germany in some months outsold by C-Class, always trounced
by
 > VW Golf/Bora.
 >
 > I doubt people base their decision on where the drive wheels are.
 >
 > DAS
 > --
 > For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
 > ---
 >
 > "GRL" <GLitwinski DeleteThis @chartermi.net> wrote in message
 > news:cYcBd.1427$qQ5.583@fe03.lga...
  > > Going through the pictures at the web site...
  > >
  > > Don't care for the slope of the nose/hood.
  > >
  > > Rear looks OK (nut no better than that).
  > >
  > > Hate the slash on the side of the car. The huge bumper cover/rear
quarter
  > > seam behind the rear wheel is...huge and breaks up the flow as your eye
  > > passes over it.
  > >
  > > Interior looks bland. Picture it without the steering wheel and it is
  > > frighteningly bland.
  > >
  > > From the top left view they give it looks squat and fat. I think the E46
  > > looks better than the G35, but the E90 puts them at parity, at best. A
  > > definite step backwards (and I don't mean to earlier generation
3-Series).
  > >
  > > Watch the video and you see how the front and rear just don't go
together.
  > > The front is very "new look" the rear is very "traditional". The front
  > > looks like a Mitsubishi was the inspiration. Not the best inspiration.
  > >
  > > I am very wary of the active steering.
  > >
  > > The new BMW 3 liter six with 255 hp will likely be incrementally better
  > > than the M54 six, which is not a bad thing to say since that engine is
  > > just excellent. However, Infiniti is at 298 hp in the G35 - that's
closer
  > > to M3 power than the new BMW six is to G35 power. Not good.
  > >
  > > I think they've lost their way. The car will sell OK because there
really
  > > is very little small sedan RWD competition and because it still is a BMW
  > > and some people will buy nothing else.
  > >
  > > - GRL
  > >
  > > Cutiebunny wrote:
   > >> Hello there, have you been to BMW's website? I saw their new 3-series
   > >> today and I was relieved to see that it doesn't look as bad as the
   > >> 5-series. Overall it looks fine, although I still prefer the hood on
the
   > >> current 3-series, in which the kidney grills are built into the hood.
   > >> The new 3-series hood is separated from the kidney grills, just like
the
   > >> new 5-series. The new 3 supposedly has a better performance but I hope
it
   > >> is also as reliable.
   > >>
   > >> What do you all think of the new 3-series?
   > >>
   > >>
   > >> Cutiebunny.
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

1) Yes, probably a bit cheaper.

2) Don't know about size, but broadly similar, I would have thought.

Both above can be checked by a look at their respective websites. But have
to focus on getting booze out....


3) BMW has cracking sales performance in Germany. No 2 in 2003 and 2002
and No. 3 in 2001 (based on registration statistics).

(cf C-Class: 2003: 6th, 2002: 3rd, 2001: 2nd)

Just for contrast,Britain's top-seller, the Ford Focus, was 9th, 8th, 8th
respectively in Germany.

Here are the 2003 & 2002 figs:
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.kfz-auskunft.de/kfz/pkw_neuzulassungen_2003.html" target="_blank">http://www.kfz-auskunft.de/kfz/pkw_neuzulassungen_2003.html</a>


Happy and peaceful year to one and all.
DAS
--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---

"GRL" <GLitwinski.RemoveThis@CHARTERMI.NET> wrote in message
news:67jBd.1557$Uy2.688@fe03.lga...
 > Isn't the Golf a lot cheaper? Also smaller? RWD matters a lot to people
 > who
 > enjoy great handling. Less so to people who are after interior room, bang
 > for the Euro, and better traction on snow.
 >
 >
 > - GRL
 > "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng.RemoveThis@nospam.co.uk> wrote in message
 > news:41d5659e$0$16589$cc9e4d1f@news-text.dial.pipex.com...
  >> In home market Germany in some months outsold by C-Class, always trounced
 > by
  >> VW Golf/Bora.
++++++++++++++++++++++<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

"Cutiebunny" <cutiebunny.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:wYednaZ_Fqj-Q0ncRVn-pg@comcast.com...
 > Hello there, have you been to BMW's website? I saw their new 3-series
today
 > and I was relieved to see that it doesn't look as bad as the 5-series.
 > Overall it looks fine, although I still prefer the hood on the current
 > 3-series, in which the kidney grills are built into the hood. The new
 > 3-series hood is separated from the kidney grills, just like the new
 > 5-series. The new 3 supposedly has a better performance but I hope it is
 > also as reliable.
 >
 > What do you all think of the new 3-series?
Looks like shit
---
633CSI
 >
 >
 > Cutiebunny.
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

GRL wrote:

 > The new BMW 3 liter six with 255 hp will likely be incrementally
better
 > than the M54 six, which is not a bad thing to say since that engine
is
 > just excellent. However, Infiniti is at 298 hp in the G35 - that's
 > closer to M3 power than the new BMW six is to G35 power. Not good.

How many countries is that "Infiniti" sold in? I believe it would be
one or two. And does Infiniti make a 3.0 litre version of that engine,
to allow for a valid comparison?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series 

"GRL" <GLitwinski.DeleteThis@CHARTERMI.NET> wrote in message
news:e4jBd.1555$Rv2.1501@fe03.lga...

 > The G35 has been a bit slower than the E46 equivalents. But I suspect that
 > has something to do with the G35 being a bigger (heavier) car. Big adds
 > comfort, but it subtracts performance.

I think it has something to do with the engines elasticity and subsequent
inability to gear it for performance levels equallying the BMW.

Lots of cars have bigger HP numbers than Bimmers, but Bimmers often seem to
do better with smaller outputs. And the reason is that the engines are so
refined that they allow the engineers to explore gearing ratios and
combinations that lesser (not necessarily lower HP) engines cannot....be it
due to CAFE requirements or warranty exposures.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The All-New 2006 3 Series